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Thread: The OT thread V1

  1. #2101
    Quote Originally Posted by pbjosh View Post
    I looked into that, and I see your point. And I stated I wanted to see production car racing.

    Which does exist here and there, with out a lot of mods. There are some spec ones also.

    Must be horrible though, all those cars exploding all the time. Oh wait...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vM5XvpeKzu8

    "Other than some heavy duty shocks and a roll cage, it's basically off the showroom floor."

    1999 Rally Cup Production Class Champion. A friggen New Beetle.

    Terrible racing, eh? Exploded, eh? Can't be raced, eh?



    As somebody said, people race lawnmowers. People will race production cars. And look, they don't all explode. Funny that.
    Exactly, i agree, if you want some way to race production vehicles, the only fair way to do it is to race the production vehicles.

    Plus, if these drivers are half as Skillfull and athletic as fans claim them to be, im sure they can manage to race the vehicles competetively within their limits without blowing them up.

  2. #2102
    ok, so you guys want to pay 5-40k more for your sports cars, and have them be totally useless as street cars then?

    cool.

    i mean even street GT3s don't have the cooling required for sports car racing, never mind vipers, corvettes, BMWs etc ...

    id love to see how many 911s and corvettes would sell with 800lbs+ springs and 3.2hz natural frequencies too. lol. the fundamental problem you guys are facing is that to make a car faster, you make it worse as a car. we have not even touched on bushings, anti-dive and squat, hot differentials and the lovely sounds they make, straight cut gears etc etc we dont see these things on street cars because they are terrible to actually drive. people claim to want a race car for the road, but having diven race cars, you do not want a race car for the road. ever. they are shitty. only folks who dont know what a race car actually is, want one for the street.
    Last edited by cockerpunk; 06-14-2017 at 09:04 PM.
    social conservatism: the mortal fear that someone, somewhere, might be having fun.

  3. #2103
    i mean lets talk about straight cut gears themselves for a second. huge advantage. also, fucking awful.

    who is going to buy a car that when you drive it sounds like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dmJH84FnQa8

    no one, thats who.
    social conservatism: the mortal fear that someone, somewhere, might be having fun.

  4. #2104
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    Oh yeah, straight cut gear vs Helix is a big deal. I get that.

    But, in the end, people DO race production vehicles with little changes to them. There seems to be several classes of it, and they are not allowed to do things like change out to straight cut gears, or anything else.

    Your point is lost because people actually do what you say they can not do, have been for decades, and there are several classes that allow it with small varying of rules.

    Your position is it will ruin production cars, they will be to expensive and horrible to drive, yet....

    The is racing classes that actually exist with production cars. And they are none of these things. Their mere existence ruins the last 3 pages of your comments.

    They race. They don't esxplod!, and they are competitive with little or no mods beyond safety.

    So, nevermind. Thanks for the discussion, I now have some great new stuff to look into.
    Josh Coray
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  5. #2105
    showroom stock classes are neither showroom, nor stock, nor popular, and yes, they do break/blow up all the time. and they are basically BoPed

    i knew a guy with a showroom stock car, and he would bend brake brackets in every race. every single session, he had to install a spare set of brake brackets. but you can't upgrade them, not allowed by the rules.
    Last edited by cockerpunk; 06-15-2017 at 01:44 PM.
    social conservatism: the mortal fear that someone, somewhere, might be having fun.

  6. #2106
    what your failing to grasp is that as soon as your racing series becomes popular and folks want to run it, the car companies will start building to the rules. which means now the definition of "production car" becomes an issue, how many do you need to produce for it to be production? thus you get into homologation numbers, 10?, 1000?, 100,000? and depending on where you put that number, that determines the cost, and the only real question is who is willing to eat more cost in order to make a car that is a better race car, but a worse street car and accept that they won't sell them.

    we've been down this road a half a dozen times with different rule sets in racing.



    i think what you are looking for is street bragging rights, to buy a car that someone else won in against similar cars. and thats pretty stupid, because that isn't how the world works. because the guys who can drive, always beat the lumps of meat, regardless of car: https://youtu.be/NSq5Zb5ZNWY?t=12m52s
    Last edited by cockerpunk; 06-15-2017 at 01:59 PM.
    social conservatism: the mortal fear that someone, somewhere, might be having fun.

  7. #2107
    this came up in a conversation and fits this thread: http://jalopnik.com/turning-a-salvag...pai-1796069041

    another reason why racing non-race cars is a terrible idea.
    social conservatism: the mortal fear that someone, somewhere, might be having fun.

  8. #2108
    I agree with cockerpunk for probably the first time ever. If production car races mattered at all to car manufacturers, they'd produce some loud, harsh shitbox that would be miserable to sit in on the street. However, they don't, which is why you see automakers contribute towards real races but leave unmodified, production car races to the average amateur joe who does a few track days a year at most.

    A certain car winning a production-car-only race means nothing because it just shows which car leans the furthest towards being track-focused and away from street-friendly. It's just a matter of engineering choices made during the design and development of a car. It's akin to having a competition where you take all airplanes currently produced and see which one has the shortest take-off distance. "Oh, my Cessna 172 can take off in under 2000 feet. Your U2 can't even land without a spotter car or scratching the fuck out of a wing. My Cessna must be a better airplane."

    Actually, a more relevant example would be paintball gun max ROF. Who gives a shit who makes the fastest gun out of the box?
    Last edited by tyronejk; 06-15-2017 at 10:24 PM.

  9. #2109
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    Quote Originally Posted by cockerpunk View Post
    i mean lets talk about straight cut gears themselves for a second. huge advantage. also, fucking awful.

    who is going to buy a car that when you drive it sounds like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dmJH84FnQa8

    no one, thats who.
    Fuck Yea!!! I DO!!!!!
    Dear boy, I work at Planet Eclipse, don't you know..

  10. #2110
    i had a solid trans mount in the 944, and i am a race car driver. like i actually do drive and own race cars, while racing, on race tracks. i was 28 at the time, no kids, no wife, i thought i could handle hard core.

    i could not.

    the gear whine was unbearable. rear end of the car felt fantastic, so trustworthy, but the gear whine was unbearable in a street car. every noise the LSD made, was awful. it was bad.

    i pulled it back out as soon as i could. that wasn't even straight cut gears, that was just helical gear noise translated directly into the unibody.
    social conservatism: the mortal fear that someone, somewhere, might be having fun.

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