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Thread: The OT thread V1

  1. #1001
    Insider Pump Scout's Avatar
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    Both ends of extremism are highly dangerous. What's really spooky is that the current climate of the nation is that you're either far left or far right, and there's not much room in the middle or you've pissed off everyone. Actually, people in the middle tend to be viewed, from what I can tell, as far right by the far leftists, or far left by the far rightists. Not much fun.

    Neither "party", nor structure of belief that's come to be so prominent in America, has all the answers for every problem. Neither side has much capacity to listen and reason beyond their own huffing and puffing, either.

  2. #1002
    Insider PBSteve's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by new ion? View Post
    I asked a bunch of friends, and among undergrads, grouping all visible minorities, we're probably pretty proportionate. Graduate studies in engineering is almost dominated by international students, and I would say it's similar outside of engineering, if not engineering has more international students.
    I don't care for the whole "safe space" thing being used to stifle conversation, dissent, and "offensive" material, but I will say that if UVic is anything like the "great white north" I grew up in, POC probably constitute what, less than 10% of the student body? Excluding asians and international students, likely less than 5%? Consider that student group is probably essentially a support group.

    Some of the more sobering experiences leaving Wisconsin were walking into rooms where I was the racial minority. Nobody's hostile about it, nobody really minds, but just having the only white skin in a room full of people who probably barely even notice my white skin can be uncomfortable. It unquestionably would have made dealing with all the normal stresses of University more difficult, where just walking into a classroom can become a barrier. It seems reasonable for people to want somewhere to process that, and to be blunt I'm not sure it can be done with white people in the mix.

    A student group seems about the most appropriate thing I could come up with to do that.
    Last edited by PBSteve; 11-23-2015 at 05:21 PM.
    Ever so many citizens of this republic think they ought to believe that the Universe is a monarchy, and therefore they are always at odds with the republic. -Alan Watts

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  3. #1003
    Insider AndrewTheWookie's Avatar
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    If the situation was reversed, imagine the shitstorm if an area with a white minority started a group and said "whites only."
    I don't know, fly casual

  4. #1004
    Insider PBSteve's Avatar
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    I think you've sort of glossed over what an "area" is with that though. The US and Canada are culturally, politically and socially dominated by white culture. Even if there were a city with a white minority, it still exists within that context.

    I don't think you'd have much problem going to, for example, Latin America or southeast Asia and starting such a group. Particularly Asia. You're significantly the minority, you have relatively little political, social or cultural power in those areas so I doubt anyone would care.
    Last edited by PBSteve; 11-23-2015 at 06:00 PM.
    Ever so many citizens of this republic think they ought to believe that the Universe is a monarchy, and therefore they are always at odds with the republic. -Alan Watts

    I work for the company building the Paragon

  5. #1005
    Insider new ion?'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PBSteve View Post
    I don't care for the whole "safe space" thing being used to stifle conversation, dissent, and "offensive" material, but I will say that if UVic is anything like the "great white north" I grew up in, POC probably constitute what, less than 10% of the student body? Excluding asians and international students, likely less than 5%? Consider that student group is probably essentially a support group.

    Some of the more sobering experiences leaving Wisconsin were walking into rooms where I was the racial minority. Nobody's hostile about it, nobody really minds, but just having the only white skin in a room full of people who probably barely even notice my white skin can be uncomfortable. It unquestionably would have made dealing with all the normal stresses of University more difficult, where just walking into a classroom can become a barrier. It seems reasonable for people to want somewhere to process that, and to be blunt I'm not sure it can be done with white people in the mix.

    A student group seems about the most appropriate thing I could come up with to do that.
    For the record, I'd say our Asian enrollment is MUCH higher than 5% - probably something like 20%. Actually. Our classes are filling with people of other cultures.

    I do get what you're saying, but it feels weird for them to have ~$15000/term. I have NO IDEA what they do/spend the money on.

  6. #1006
    Insider PBSteve's Avatar
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    Seems like there's probably room for discussion around a budget of $15k :P
    Ever so many citizens of this republic think they ought to believe that the Universe is a monarchy, and therefore they are always at odds with the republic. -Alan Watts

    I work for the company building the Paragon

  7. #1007
    pewpewpew vijil's Avatar
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    Actually, people in the middle tend to be viewed, from what I can tell, as far right by the far leftists, or far left by the far rightists. Not much fun.
    Which makes you wonder how many people are actually on the fringes vs somewhere in the middlle. The fringes tend to be noisier is all. Flip the bell curve to get noise levels.

    I'm (currently) leaning towards minarchism, so I have no idea where that places me. Most folks would say right, but then I'd scrap all IP laws in a heartbeat which isn't exactly friendly to big business.
    Last edited by vijil; 11-23-2015 at 06:50 PM.
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  8. #1008
    eeekk, i understand that IP is anti-capitalist and anti-free market. but in a modern world of billion dollar research projects, we need to reward those who are willing to, and successfully invest in such endeavors.
    social conservatism: the mortal fear that someone, somewhere, might be having fun.

  9. #1009
    pewpewpew vijil's Avatar
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    Actually it's highly overrated. First mover advantage, marketing and trade secrets are far more powerful when used wisely, and legally enforced monopoly just reinforces the very problems free market capitalism is accused of creating. Patent law (which isn't exactly an exact science anyway) only really rewards those with the bigger budget to enforce, after all. It's a very long discussion - sufficed to say that our current IP system has been hijacked by monopolists, a vastly wasteful legal profession, and patent trolls. We'd be better off without it.

    http://www.theatlantic.com/business/...f-them/262913/ - a reasonably good start. There are certain industries where a lack of patent law may in fact lead to slow progress, but that's what things like x-prizes and foundations etc. are for.
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  10. #1010
    the notion that the X prize will replace the profit motive created by IP law, is insane.

    http://annualreport.xprize.org/#financials

    ~60 million dollars. woop dee do. thats a joke.

    yup, thats going to motivate essentially no one. in my line of work we don't even a touch a project without a 100+ million per year opportunity. i have several research projects aimed at 500+ million dollar opportunities. IP is a key component in each of these cases.

    and if you think IP law is a measure who is richer, than consider that IP law is the ONLY thing that holds start ups together. without IP law, a start ups value is zero. literally ... zero. never start a new company. there is zero motivation to do it. most start ups start with an idea, a spin off of academia, patent protected, and then seek to show that ideas viability, and thus either bring it to market themselves, or more commonly, get bought by someone big. and what if there IP was not protected? well, we'd just read the literature, and do it ourselves. we'd just copy them, because we have products that loose more money than there entire 5 year operating budget.

    IP protects the little guy. gives start ups value. keeps the industry moving. brings disruptive technology to fruition.

    I don't disagree that trade secret is a strong part of an good IP position, there is a reason i have to be intentionally vague about what i do, and how we do it. and i have to let other folks win the "i have the most accurate machine" arguments, because if they knew what we do around here on a daily basis, it would literally blow there minds. i understand the role of trade secret. but to think that pittly little charitable organizations are going to keep folks motivated to spend on R&D is insane.

    the US alone spends 405 billion dollars a year on R&D. .4 trillion and change .... and the xprize is gonna keep that engine fueled? hahahaha
    social conservatism: the mortal fear that someone, somewhere, might be having fun.

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