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  1. #1981
    Insider PBSteve's Avatar
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    Joe Walsh: Challenging Trump for the GOP nomination taught me my party is a cult
    Real conservatives think for themselves. Trump Republicans have been brainwashed.
    By Joe Walsh
    Joe Walsh is a former Illinois congressman.

    When I announced my primary challenge to President Trump last year, I knew running against him for the GOP nomination was the ultimate long shot. Even now, after impeachment, after three years of vulgarities, inanities, betrayals and racist screeds, he has a 94 percent approval rating among Republicans in the latest Gallup poll.

    My chances are slim * don*t worry, I know.

    It*s been made even tougher by the party canceling primaries to shield the president from being challenged. And by Fox News, and the rest of Trump*s lapdog conservative media, denying me airtime. But I*ve been on TV, I*ve served in Congress and I hosted my own talk-radio show. I don*t need the airtime. More than anything else, what*s made this challenge nearly impossible * to a degree that I didn*t fully realize when I first hit the trail * is how brainwashed so many of my fellow Republicans seem to have become. I hate to say it, but the GOP now resembles a cult.

    I was already sensing this, but I was slapped hard in the face this past week at the Iowa caucuses: Last Thursday, the president came to Des Moines for one of his narcissistic rallies. I was in Des Moines, too, so I tried to talk to some folks outside the event before they went in * makes sense, right? Here*s a captive audience of Republican voters. But it turned out to be one of the most frustrating (and frankly, sad) experiences I can recall. I asked dozens of people a very simple, straightforward question: *Has President Trump ever told a lie to the American people?* And every single person said, *No.* Never mind that thousands of his misstatements have been meticulously documented. No, they said, he*s never lied.

    I brought up his years-old claims that, unlike President Barack Obama, if Trump ever became president, he*d be too busy to play golf. Most people responded by saying they don*t care whether Trump golfs. But three people said that Trump has never golfed since he*s been president. No one said that they thought he did anything wrong with Ukraine. No one knew that our annual deficits just blew past $1 trillion. Everyone believed hundreds of miles of new wall had been built. (Fact check: False!) When I asked whether they thought Mexico was paying for the wall, most people said yes but were at a loss to explain how. On and on it went: CNN was the enemy and Rep. Adam B. Schiff (Calif.), along with the rest of the congressional Democrats, were lying traitors.

    I also phone-banked this week, calling potential Republican caucus-goers throughout Iowa. I always knew it when I got a strong Trump supporter on the line by the language they used and the tone that they took: They*d say no president has been attacked like Trump has or no president has had to deal with such hatred and opposition. (Again: Not true!) They*d get defensive and throw out more lies and half-truths: China is paying for the tariffs, Joe Biden was covering up for his son, and Russia didn*t do anything in the 2016 election were all popular. On and on it went: I ended my two hours of phone time each day pretty bummed out by the mis- and disinformation I*d heard.

    Then came Monday night: I went to a caucus and gave a speech to about 3,000 Iowa Republicans. I*ve never been to a MAGA rally, but it sure felt like one. The president*s daughter-in-law, Lara Trump, spoke first and underscored the Trump bottom line: Perfect phone call; Democrats bad; keep America great. Crowd goes wild. I then got up to make my pitch, and * as you may have seen * it didn*t go well. I got booed for saying that our party needed to do some soul-searching. I said the party is going to be a party of old white men unless we become more inclusive. More boos. I said we shouldn*t be okay with a president who lies all the time. I said we need a president who*s decent, not cruel. I said, you might enjoy Trump*s mean tweets, but most people don*t. I said we must be better than a president who makes every day about himself. Boos. And more boos. One woman yelled that she loves the president*s tweets. The crowd cheered her.

    No thanks, Joe Walsh. Your primary challenge might only help Trump.

    I reminded folks that I*m a conservative, but I said conservative policies aren*t good enough. Decency, honesty and compassion matter, too. But they wanted nothing to do with it. There was more booing, more yelling, and I caught a middle finger or two. I*m a big boy, and I can take a tough crowd, but leaving the caucus that night, I realized once and for all that nobody can beat Trump in a Republican primary. Not just because it*s become his party, but because it has become a cult, and he*s a cult leader. He doesn*t have supporters; he has followers. And in their eyes, he can do no wrong.

    They*re being spoon-fed a daily dose of B.S. from *conservative* media. They don*t know what the truth is and * more importantly * they don*t care. There*s nothing that any Republican challenger can do to break them out of this spell. (Thanks, Hannity.)

    Part of me was dejected. But part of me was still hopeful * that a conservative movement based on compassion, honesty, opportunity and inclusion can and will emerge someday soon. I may not always have appreciated that; I may not have always said it. But I*m not part of a cult! I try to learn from new information, and I think for myself. Clearly, that*s not the Trump GOP. I have faith, though, that there are enough principled conservatives out there who think like I do.
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlo...uPsJw6SWl-sFW8

    Still a bit delusional, but he tried.
    Ever so many citizens of this republic think they ought to believe that the Universe is a monarchy, and therefore they are always at odds with the republic. -Alan Watts

    I work for the company building the Paragon

  2. #1982
    Insider AndrewTheWookie's Avatar
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    I'd say he's full of shit. Everything about Trump is what he's wanted for the GOP, I think he just didn't want such a polarizing figurehead to do it and risk a backlash to everything he and the GOP have worked for. Trump is who he's always been. I don't trust anyone who says they've "seen the light" so to speak, because nothing's changed in the last ~3 years. The things they claim to dislike have been there since day 1. He loves what the GOP currently is, he just doesn't like that it's turned into Trump's GOP.

    From elsewhere:

    Before the presidential election he said:

    On November 8th, I'm voting for Trump.
    On November 9th, if Trump loses, I'm grabbing my musket.
    You in?

    Here's an excerpt on some of his views:

    Trump, Walsh wrote in a New York Times op-ed earlier this month, is not a good leader, but a "racial arsonist who encourages bigotry and xenophobia."

    Walsh should know.

    The one-term former House member from Chicago, who now hosts a radio talk show, has a long history of making racist and incendiary comments, particularly about Barack Obama. He falsely accused the former president of being a secret Muslim who hates Israel and regularly questioned his birthplace - a conspiracy theory also embraced by the current occupant of the Oval Office. Obama, Walsh further argued, only won the 2008 election because he is a "black man who was articulate."

    In 2016, after a police shooting in Dallas, Walsh promised "war" and warned Obama to "watch out," alleging that he helped get "cops killed." After the 2015 domestic terror attack in San Bernardino, California, he urged people to "do whatever we can to defeat Islam." He was also briefly kicked off the air for using racial and ethnic slurs on his radio show.

    https://www.huffingtonpost.ca/entry/joe-walsh-trump-2020_n_5d5e988fe4b0dfcbd4893ef9?ri18n=true
    Last edited by AndrewTheWookie; 02-07-2020 at 09:48 PM.
    I don't know, fly casual

  3. #1983
    Whether it is the deathrow inmate who finally accepts god into their hearts, or the disillusioned political servant(nee hack) that sees what they believe is the drastic change of their party, they are all full of shit. Anyone who wants to run in politics shouldn't be there. I for one said the best president you could have is someone who doesn't want the job. That way they see the presidency as a job to be done quickly, quietly and efficiently and not as a destiny, a deliverance from god, or what they deserve.

    Maybe Walsh is upset that Trump is molding the GOP into a new form of stormtrumpers(intentional misspelling ), taking away his base. Maybe trump knows the secret sauce to get people to turn off their minds in 140 characters or less, maybe trump is the greatest magician since the great & powerful Oz and show the world the slight of hand of a master. Maybe this will be the straw that breaks the camel's back of the political parties in the US.

    I see the same gestures that Mussolini, Hitler & Stalin used to sway the people to think what they want(though Trump wishes he could use all of Papa Joe's methods). What is the difference from a MAGA rally and those the Nazis did at Nuremberg? What promises are made and never given that are a change from the past?

    A week ago, trump had a rally near me(like 5mi away). It is a coastal town, about 7mi long, 1mi wide, built on a sandbar, surrounded by salt water marsh & ocean. A tourist destination, with houses, hotels and motels, business; yet he talked about the evil party taking away the cows. Because NJ is well know for its plentiful and prodigious cattle ranches... it is almost like a game of having trump say the most outrageous things, just to see if the people ever catch him. As he is laughing all the way. But trump is not that smart for that...

  4. #1984
    Insider Pump Scout's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nobody View Post
    Who knew Mitt Romney had a backbone & a conscious? Go figure...
    Mitt Romney's actions have nothing to do with having a backbone or a conscious. They have everything to do with trying to position himself to be a power player again. Won't work, he had his shot and failed to make it, and he won't get another one.

  5. #1985
    when republicans do finally see what is happening and has happened to there party, i have to ask .... how did you not see this coming? like did you really think you could keep a cap on the anti-intellectualism, anti-democratic, and racism and use the group think to ONLY the ends you wanted to? the entire problem with anti-intellectualism and anti-democracy and group think is that nothing makes sense anymore. nothing. including the pet projects you actually wanted to work on. including the things you want to accomplish. they cultivated this for decades, what did they honestly think would happen?

    the reason you don't go down this path is when you put willfully stupid people in charge, you can't control the situation anymore. what did they was going to happen?

    the republican party has been flirting with this since at least the early 1990s, probably even earlier with the whole "we knew tax cuts didnt pay for themselves, thats why reagan had to raise taxes 9 times" stupidity. but at some point rather than knowing it was lie, republicans started believing there own lies. what started as convenient excuses to give the rich doners what they wanted, they truly drank there own poison and actually think what they are saying works.

    and now its reached a point where the truth doesn't even matter anymore. republicans and there voters know 100% trump is guilty. they just dont care.

    im happy conservative intellectuals like george will and frum and such are seeing the light and joining the resistence, i really am. but at some point i also have to ask them "what did you think was going to happen when for 30 years you told people that the news was lying to you, only trust republican presidents who confirm your worst fears" what did they think was going to happen? how exactly was this not going to backfire terribly?
    Last edited by cockerpunk; 02-10-2020 at 10:54 AM.
    social conservatism: the mortal fear that someone, somewhere, might be having fun.

  6. #1986
    Quote Originally Posted by cockerpunk View Post
    when republicans do finally see what is happening and has happened to there party, i have to ask .... how did you not see this coming? like did you really think you could keep a cap on the anti-intellectualism, anti-democratic, and racism and use the group think to ONLY the ends you wanted to? the entire problem with anti-intellectualism and anti-democracy and group think is that nothing makes sense anymore. nothing. including the pet projects you actually wanted to work on. including the things you want to accomplish. they cultivated this for decades, what did they honestly think would happen?

    the reason you don't go down this path is when you put willfully stupid people in charge, you can't control the situation anymore. what did they was going to happen?

    the republican party has been flirting with this since at least the early 1990s, probably even earlier with the whole "we knew tax cuts didnt pay for themselves, thats why reagan had to raise taxes 9 times" stupidity. but at some point rather than knowing it was lie, republicans started believing there own lies. what started as convenient excuses to give the rich doners what they wanted, they truly drank there own poison and actually think what they are saying works.

    and now its reached a point where the truth doesn't even matter anymore. republicans and there voters know 100% trump is guilty. they just dont care.

    im happy conservative intellectuals like george will and frum and such are seeing the light and joining the resistence, i really am. but at some point i also have to ask them "what did you think was going to happen when for 30 years you told people that the news was lying to you, only trust republican presidents who confirm your worst fears" what did they think was going to happen? how exactly was this not going to backfire terribly?
    I am pretty skeptical that any of them really think the tax policies that they are putting in place are doing good for the country, and not just for their fellow wealthy americans who donate to them and help keep them wealthy. That would cut both ways though, I severely doubt either side is going to be for enacting policies that actively hurt themselves

  7. #1987
    Quote Originally Posted by Pump Scout View Post
    Mitt Romney's actions have nothing to do with having a backbone or a conscious. They have everything to do with trying to position himself to be a power player again. Won't work, he had his shot and failed to make it, and he won't get another one.
    He didn't vote along Republican lines. He has been sited as a pariah in the Republican party. He would have no powerbase to launch any relection as a senator, forget running for the presidency again, unless he self funds the endeavor and he wouldn't get the Republican nod even if he were to come close to winning the primary.

    If his words are true, and even though i do not agree with the man, that through his conscience, through his own personal ethics, are true, that has nothing to do with anything more than seing wrong, seeing a political exploitation of the party & democracy, and the man in question subborning allegedly, illegal acts that go against his oath of office, the constitution and intelligence.

    If Romney wanted to be a power player again, he would have challenged trump for the Republican nomination. He would have played more politics to position himself to run again, not insult his party, not insult their meek will, and not try to stand against the wrongs that he see.

    This has intrigued me as to why you say this. Care to elaborate?

  8. #1988
    Quote Originally Posted by cockerpunk View Post
    when republicans do finally see what is happening and has happened to there party, i have to ask .... how did you not see this coming? like did you really think you could keep a cap on the anti-intellectualism, anti-democratic, and racism and use the group think to ONLY the ends you wanted to? the entire problem with anti-intellectualism and anti-democracy and group think is that nothing makes sense anymore. nothing. including the pet projects you actually wanted to work on. including the things you want to accomplish. they cultivated this for decades, what did they honestly think would happen?
    Simply put, politicians who want to stay in power, sell their soul to keep that power. Ethics and morals were last century. If you are naive to the problem, then you are naive to the solution. Trump came in like a storm, attached himself to the party and like in his private life bullied his way through to the top, establishing himself as the do'er & say'er of the party. You do not give the wolf the key to the chicken coop and expect him not to do exact what he will.

    Quote Originally Posted by cockerpunk View Post
    the reason you don't go down this path is when you put willfully stupid people in charge, you can't control the situation anymore. what did they was going to happen?
    Stupid people don't realize they are stupid. And when you have a loose cannon, you can't expect it to play nice when you still don't bother to tie it down. And they would think that they can extort "order" by holding over the truth of the impeachment. Again, stupid people.

    Quote Originally Posted by cockerpunk View Post
    the republican party has been flirting with this since at least the early 1990s, probably even earlier with the whole "we knew tax cuts didnt pay for themselves, thats why reagan had to raise taxes 9 times" stupidity. but at some point rather than knowing it was lie, republicans started believing there own lies. what started as convenient excuses to give the rich doners what they wanted, they truly drank there own poison and actually think what they are saying works.
    When you tell lies for so long, you believ the lies to be truths. Either that is what they believe, i.e. the party line and they don't think anything else or they do not look for the truth, doing the due diligence to find the change deep in the laws. Mostly, they really only want the clout of being a "civil servant" that tbey can have those letters behind their name, pull out whatever badge, card or phone nunber to make themselves important. And, as long as it is a benefit to themselves that is all that matters.

    Quote Originally Posted by cockerpunk View Post
    and now its reached a point where the truth doesn't even matter anymore. republicans and there voters know 100% trump is guilty. they just dont care.
    I blame education, i blame the media. No, not like trump with "fake news", but how the education system fails to teach the importance of learning, of how the world works, instead of the bare basics. I blame the media of covering up the things that should matter, that should effect the people, and to show that your individual voices are minuscule in the ocean of government. They don't, won't or can't show ramifications of such acts, and still be engaging without being preachy. We are a nation of memes, and tweets. Whether the masses have come down to the POTUS' level or the accessibility has turned to bits and pieces. Click bait, snappy headlines, whatever. We don't want boring drudgery, or red tape. Situational comedies in 23min. Dramas completed in 46min. News when we ask it.

    Quote Originally Posted by cockerpunk View Post
    im happy conservative intellectuals like george will and frum and such are seeing the light and joining the resistence, i really am. but at some point i also have to ask them "what did you think was going to happen when for 30 years you told people that the news was lying to you, only trust republican presidents who confirm your worst fears" what did they think was going to happen? how exactly was this not going to backfire terribly?
    Time only tells. No one saw the result of Reagan outspending the Soviets into the ground. McNamara and his wizkids doing the bean counting from halfway around the world on a global conflict. The only way to stop government is to radically overhual it to the point that the fat, the waste and the rhetoric are cut out.

  9. #1989
    Romney knows that the future will not be kind to trump or his supporters. he will be fine in the senate, and would never be able to challenge trump for the nomination. the GOP is trumps party now, Romney would be utterly crushed for the nomination, but should have no issue holding his senate seat.
    social conservatism: the mortal fear that someone, somewhere, might be having fun.

  10. #1990
    I agree with that, he is perfectly safe with his mormon voting base in his home state to be safe for his current seat.

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