OT: Politics

[cockerpunk]

I was replying to Steve, Gordon. It isn't always about you.

The NPC was in reply to you saying this:



"NPC Response - NPC #2408180
Has anyone told you that your a Basement Dweller.Fucking Misogynist.You being a hack causes deaths everyday.Just remember, people like you will cause slavery to come back.lunatic."

NPC Response - NPC #2311219
Look at the Deplorable we have here!Both you and Trump are a racist.I will always fight against scum's like you.Just remember, people like you will cause slavery to come back.idiot.

NPC Response - NPC #5907671
Wow, talk about a Snowflake.No matter what you say, you are a Misogynist.I will always fight against extremist's like you.Just remember, people like you will cause millions of womens deaths.nutjob.

It really could be cut and paste.

I think the report highlights exactly why your commentary on here, and Steve's, IS the problem. It is mean spirited and comes from such a myopic position that you don't realize you are insulting and degrading the vast majority of the 'Exhausted middle' like myself who really tire of what is total crap shoot bullshit.

In reality your position is only held up in a political echo chamber, and your tribalism is what is causing the problem.

The more you insult and virtue signal by calling people racist and going fully over the top the more you alienate everyone else except your tribe. Steve is of your tribe so you guys play in this little echo chamber, but the reality is most people are sick of it. Sick of all this PC bullshit. Sick of the condemnation and related crap. (small edit - it is obvious even Ryan is sick of it.)

You are not the middle. Or even one side. You are the 8% that is the most extreme at the moment. Even worse than conservatives at the moment.

And you bore the piss out of me. Because nothing are saying is really anything different than a NPC generator. It is anti-intellectualism.

actually, im just a typically 1990s liberal on basically every policy level. you mistake my lack of giving two shits about conservative thoughts with being farther left than i actually am, i simply have no tolerance for the willfully ignorant. this is confusing to you, because you don't grasp that where you are on the spectrum of political thought isn't related to the method or emotion or passion with which you argue. it also does not matter on any level what so ever, how large a percent of the population agrees with you, it only matters how factually correct and evidence supported your positions are.

your post does not contain a counter point to the argument that conservative fiscal policy is based on racism.

i do not give a shit about your feelings. sorry not sorry. if you don't want to have your positions accused of racism, then your going to have to show how they arn't based on racism.

pretty simple.

[pbjosh]

Since you had to cite racism a half dozen times, it shows you are not a typical liberal.

You are the 8%. Read the study. That vast majority of the US ABHOR racism.

In the past I have shown that America is easily one of the least racist countries in the world, but also now is one of the least racist points of time in american history.

That only a percentage, a small, single digit one at that, harbor any racism.

You are not living is a reality that currently exist.

Maybe 1790s?

[cockerpunk]

Since you had to cite racism a half dozen times, it shows you are not a typical liberal.

You are the 8%. Read the study. That vast majority of the US ABHOR racism.

In the past I have shown that America is easily one of the least racist countries in the world, but also now is one of the least racist points of time in american history.

That only a percentage, a small, single digit one at that, harbor any racism.

You are not living is a reality that currently exist.

Maybe 1790s?

this is not a counter point to the accusation that conservative fiscal policy is based on a racism.

you are going to have to show how fiscal conservtaive policy isn't based on racism.

[cockerpunk]

i did enjoy the self reported "oh racism isn't a problem in the USA, because everyone says they arn't racist!"

i'm glad that is settled. maybe we can take on climate change if its that easy .... oh yeah.

[Lurker27]

I love that this conversation revolves around "I'm not denying that the country is rife with racism, it's just unpopular to suggest addressing it."

My point is that I'd rather the party that has obviously better policy positions (In terms of Populist economics) shift the focus of their platform towards issues they can actually win with. There's a separate issue in that many of these same issues seem almost impossible to be effective at through policy. (See: Gun Control)

America is clearly still "pretty racist", and "pretty misogynistic", but you aren't going to extirpate those things through any policy anyway.

That's a cultural shift that will take time. We're clearly far enough along a progressive path that we can elect Obama. Perhaps that watershed moment even drove some of the racist backlash we're seeing now in politics. Gordon, you're right in that the GOP deliberately orients the political conversation around issues it's likely to win, but again that's just their machine being much, much better at pure politics. The fact that democrats consistently take the bait is worrisome. How Elizabeth Warren handled the last few weeks is, in my opinion, heartening - she seems to understand the game.

[Unfated33]

A study that a friend of mine did - change the skin tone of Barack Obama to make him darker toned, and statistically significant increases in support of the tea party are found. We are in denial about how racist we actually are.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.f775eb81e6bf

[cockerpunk]

My point is that I'd rather the party that has obviously better policy positions (In terms of Populist economics) shift the focus of their platform towards issues they can actually win with. There's a separate issue in that many of these same issues seem almost impossible to be effective at through policy. (See: Gun Control)

America is clearly still "pretty racist", and "pretty misogynistic", but you aren't going to extirpate those things through any policy anyway.

That's a cultural shift that will take time. We're clearly far enough along a progressive path that we can elect Obama. Perhaps that watershed moment even drove some of the racist backlash we're seeing now in politics. Gordon, you're right in that the GOP deliberately orients the political conversation around issues it's likely to win, but again that's just their machine being much, much better at pure politics. The fact that democrats consistently take the bait is worrisome. How Elizabeth Warren handled the last few weeks is, in my opinion, heartening - she seems to understand the game.

fear always wins. its in human nature. fear is the default, its the easiest path. over-coming fear always requires a lot of energy. the politics of fear will always be an easier path to victory. fear wins. doing something new and better, doesn't. we are creatures of habit, even when they are terrible, we just keep doing them. because fear.

[cockerpunk]

A study that a friend of mine did - change the skin tone of Barack Obama to make him darker toned, and statistically significant increases in support of the tea party are found. We are in denial about how racist we actually are.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.f775eb81e6bf

fake news

none of those people self-report as racist and thus racism is solved.

a subtle, but important distinction is not a particular person being racist or not. this is a rather pointless argument to get into. a person isn't really racist or not. in most contexts its an action, policy, or idea that is racist. when someone does something racist, they might be raciest, maybe not, but the argument should be about if that action is racist or not. or if that policy is racist or not. determining if people are racist or not ... really, at the end of the day doesn't matter. this is why republicans and conservatives try to argue about if a person is racist or not. this is why joshs attempt at a counter argument is most americans dont think they are racist people, when in reality the discussion is about the budget, and when we deficit spend on white rich dudes, no one cares, but when we spend on poor brown people, everyone thinks its a crisis. that shows its racist, or at least its deemed "ok" because of racism.

suffice to say, my claim was that you can find racist motivations and reasons for almost every policy the GOP supports. I think thats true. and it certainly explains what at first appears to be hypocritical stances, like the above mentioned, where are the deficit-hawks now that we gave a trillion dollars to rich white dudes? they don't care because it was never about the deficit.

the trump era has certainly sharpened my political rhetoric. mostly because it has made it obvious to even the most casual observer that republicans never actually gave a shit about what they claimed to, because the second they needed to abandon these values in order to attack, they did. it was never about those values. it was always about racism, or sexism, or classism. look at immigration, trade, foreign policy, domestic policy .... its just racism. a bunch of self reported free market fanbois all of a sudden against immigration, or free trade? a bunch of folks who dont care about vets, but will come in and call a special session to make sure that isreal gets more money and bombs to kill more brown people? over and over ... its just racism.

[Lurker27]

fear always wins. its in human nature. fear is the default, its the easiest path. over-coming fear always requires a lot of energy. the politics of fear will always be an easier path to victory. fear wins. doing something new and better, doesn't. we are creatures of habit, even when they are terrible, we just keep doing them. because fear.

Thanks, Machiavelli! I don't disagree with you on the diagnosis, but I think the political left should be more willing to fight fire with fire.

[pbjosh]

Never said racism isn't problem. You can't even reply without a straw man, can you? Come on, bet you have an Ad Hom just waiting in the wings.

I said it is not a large portion of the population, which is factually correct. It is not gone, but compared to most of the world, and most of history, it is nearly nonexistent. There has been so much growth culturally on this subject in the last few decades compared to thousands of years of known history, yet you can't even comprehend it, can you? Just have to pull out complete falsehoods that have no context or facts to back it up. It really is sad. You are intelligent. But the disconnect is very large.

A person should be celebrating the growth that has has happened in the last couple of generation, instead of still calling people names they do not deserve, in deliberate contrast to who they are, and how much they have grown.

That you believe it is shows your disconnect from reality. And your demonization of those who are out of your tribe. That is all this is. Bashing the non believers. Calling them names. Being an ass in front of your group of like minded bullies. Hunt down the witch and kill her. Because you believe.

All you have is a slur. A troll. Most places would have....wait, have, kicked your ass out. For this very same reason.

You are not speaking a truth. You are simply wrong. Again. The art of reflection nary pauses to furrow your brow. You puff up your chest and repeat the stupid.

Golf clap to all of you.

Good day.