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Thread: OT: Politics

  1. #591
    Insider Unfated33's Avatar
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    I think to some extent Gordon is just swinging around at the moment, because it does seem like the general sentiment on this page is "one is too many". If anyone feels like that's not true, here's the opportunity to speak up.

    ...

    I think Fukuyama is an interesting case study in America. A political scientist that initially backed the concept of neoconservatism becomes an Obama supporter becomes an author on altruism. In real time a Rockefeller Republican joins the Democratic party across his series of books.

  2. #592
    Quote Originally Posted by Unfated33 View Post
    I think to some extent Gordon is just swinging around at the moment, because it does seem like the general sentiment on this page is "one is too many". If anyone feels like that's not true, here's the opportunity to speak up.

    ...

    I think Fukuyama is an interesting case study in America. A political scientist that initially backed the concept of neoconservatism becomes an Obama supporter becomes an author on altruism. In real time a Rockefeller Republican joins the Democratic party across his series of books.
    im sick and tired of the bullshit, thats what i am.

    here is what we actually do if we want to stop mass shootings:

    0. we don't make mental health harder for the majority of americans to get help if they need it. really, get fucked republicans, don't shed your bullshit crocodile tears for this shit. mental health problem my fucking ass. your bullshit stops here.
    0a. we don't make it illegal for non-partisan government agencies from studying gun violence. NRA eat fucking shit.
    1. we end loopholes for background checks, the vast majority of Americans support this, even a majority of republicans support this.
    2. we enact a law by which law enforcement has a mechanism to take possession of guns (with court order), from folks who are known to be violent, and have mental issues.
    3. instead of spending 30 million dollars on trump jerking off to our millitary, or 30 BILLION dollars on a totally pointless wall that will do absolutly nothing to stop illegal immigration ... we spend some actual money on researching the problem. ie, we collect a databased gun incidents, accidents, murders, etc etc the way we do car accidents. we interview and physco analyze anyone who does this shit. you know ... we perform science. over 40 years we did this with car accidents, and we have vastly safer roads as a result. we chaged how we train drivers, we changed how we designed cars, we figured out ways to manage traffic more effectively ... all cause the power of big data analysis. no such data exists for gun violence. instead of bullshiting around here, what features on guns, what methods and supply chains, etc etc etc ... we just like actually study it. you know, with science.
    4. we do what the scientists say, regardless of political bullshit.

    there, solved your fucking problem. now, lets put all the bullshit notions of guns stopping tyrants, and veiled bullshit about your hobby being more important than kids lives ... and we just fix it. im sick of this bullshit. and im sorry you will be slightly inconvenienced the next time you buy a gun, really i am, but get the fuck over yourself. sorry, you can spend an extra day or two getting your 12th fucking gun, so that maybe some kid somewhere can go home to his mother again.

    i do not mean this directed at any single poster here. i mean this generally to anyone supporting such bullshit arguments.

    -signed, a gun owner
    Last edited by cockerpunk; 02-16-2018 at 02:16 PM.
    social conservatism: the mortal fear that someone, somewhere, might be having fun.

  3. #593
    also, dear chirst, mueller's indictment is fucking insane. it literally calls out known and and unknown american citizens as colluding with russians to get trump elected. wonder who those might be?

    collusion is treason.
    social conservatism: the mortal fear that someone, somewhere, might be having fun.

  4. #594
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    You as anyone should know that metrics aren't simply metrics when used as a reference point in discourse. From USA Today (who without my knowledge, also carried the headline before retracting it):

    Fake stats like that make finding a solution to the real problem of gun violence, which has actually struck American schools at least six times this year, that much harder... Everytown for Gun Safety, the gun-control advocacy group responsible for spreading this bogus statistic, should be ashamed of its blatant dishonesty. When parents hear the words ?school shooting,? their hearts freeze and their heads fill with images of Sandy Hook...
    What shouldn't count in a discussion on how to prevent incidents like this wednesday, using their proper, and official terms:
    - Suicide (where there were clearly no other intended targets)
    - Accidental Discharge
    - Unlawful/reckless discharge of a firearm (those things that have no known intent of harm or murder)

    If you take those out, you are left with (in official terms)
    - Four Attempted Homicides (or attempted Murder), with woundings
    - Two Murders
    - Two Mass Shootings / Active Shooter incidents

    You could then further whittle one of those out as one of them (a murder if I remember correctly) didn't include a student or a teacher.

    This isn't rocket science or any other field of precision engineering. These are simple statistics that "Everytown" is aware of and, they chose to make it sound worse than it really is. And understand, I'm not saying Everytown was wrong in tweeting that number. They have an agenda, and they are free to espouse their opinion. I have a problem with the press which has a responsibility to inform us, not to scare us and cause us make decisions based on emotion.

  5. #595
    muellers indictments state that the russians indicted worked with "trump campaign staff" to organize rallies in Florida, Pennsylvania and Michigan.

    mueller isn't stupid .... hes not even showing one of his cards yet ....
    social conservatism: the mortal fear that someone, somewhere, might be having fun.

  6. #596
    Quote Originally Posted by UV Halo View Post
    I have a problem with the press which has a responsibility to inform us, not to scare us and cause us make decisions based on emotion.
    Lol media companies have a responsibility to turn a profit for shareholders. It's entirely unrelated to informing the public.

  7. #597
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    Quote Originally Posted by cockerpunk View Post
    im sick and tired of the bullshit, thats what i am.

    here is what we actually do if we want to stop mass shootings:

    0. we don't make mental health harder for the majority of americans to get help if they need it. really, get fucked republicans, don't shed your bullshit crocodile tears for this shit. mental health problem my fucking ass. your bullshit stops here.
    0a. we don't make it illegal for non-partisan government agencies from studying gun violence. NRA eat fucking shit.
    1. we end loopholes for background checks, the vast majority of Americans support this, even a majority of republicans support this.
    2. we enact a law by which law enforcement has a mechanism to take possession of guns (with court order), from folks who are known to be violent, and have mental issues.
    3. instead of spending 30 million dollars on trump jerking off to our millitary, or 30 BILLION dollars on a totally pointless wall that will do absolutly nothing to stop illegal immigration ... we spend some actual money on researching the problem. ie, we collect a databased gun incidents, accidents, murders, etc etc the way we do car accidents. we interview and physco analyze anyone who does this shit. you know ... we perform science. over 40 years we did this with car accidents, and we have vastly safer roads as a result. we chaged how we train drivers, we changed how we designed cars, we figured out ways to manage traffic more effectively ... all cause the power of big data analysis. no such data exists for gun violence. instead of bullshiting around here, what features on guns, what methods and supply chains, etc etc etc ... we just like actually study it. you know, with science.
    4. we do what the scientists say, regardless of political bullshit.

    there, solved your fucking problem. now, lets put all the bullshit notions of guns stopping tyrants, and veiled bullshit about your hobby being more important than kids lives ... and we just fix it. im sick of this bullshit. and im sorry you will be slightly inconvenienced the next time you buy a gun, really i am, but get the fuck over yourself. sorry, you can spend an extra day or two getting your 12th fucking gun, so that maybe some kid somewhere can go home to his mother again.

    i do not mean this directed at any single poster here. i mean this generally to anyone supporting such bullshit arguments.

    -signed, a gun owner
    I agree with most of this. My hesitation is largely centered on "Loophole for background checks". Do you mean to say: "No more private sales/transfers without a background check"? Honestly, I could get behind that provided that it doesn't allow for the government to establish a freely researchable (without a warrant), and publishable database of gun owners.

    Another question I have- who should collect the data on firearm related incidents? In my mind, it should be law enforcement. I coould understand the CDC studying suicide or mass shootings (since there is usually a clear psychological problem that contributes to either of those situations).

  8. #598
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    Why do you not want a searchable database of gun ownership?
    "So you've done this before?"
    "Oh, hell no. But I think it's gonna work."

  9. #599
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    Quote Originally Posted by cockerpunk View Post
    muellers indictments state that the russians indicted worked with "trump campaign staff" to organize rallies in Florida, Pennsylvania and Michigan.

    mueller isn't stupid .... hes not even showing one of his cards yet ....
    Thanks for clarifying that, you had my hopes up that the indictments were published.

    Quote Originally Posted by tyronejk View Post
    Lol media companies have a responsibility to turn a profit for shareholders. It's entirely unrelated to informing the public.
    I do believe this is true for most of the for-profit press organizations to varying degrees. Personally, I'm more favorable of the NPR. That being said, I honestly believe that the public should re-examine what it means to be and what is required of a "free press" entitiy.

  10. #600
    Quote Originally Posted by UV Halo View Post
    I agree with most of this. My hesitation is largely centered on "Loophole for background checks". Do you mean to say: "No more private sales/transfers without a background check"? Honestly, I could get behind that provided that it doesn't allow for the government to establish a freely researchable (without a warrant), and publishable database of gun owners.

    Another question I have- who should collect the data on firearm related incidents? In my mind, it should be law enforcement. I coould understand the CDC studying suicide or mass shootings (since there is usually a clear psychological problem that contributes to either of those situations).
    that is who collects the data for car accidents, law enforcement.

    the CDC has been trying to study gun violence since the late 1980s, the NRA backed and got passed a law that forbids them from doing so in 1996.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lurker27 View Post
    Why do you not want a searchable database of gun ownership?
    who said that?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by UV Halo View Post
    Thanks for clarifying that, you had my hopes up that the indictments were published.
    they are published:

    https://www.vox.com/2018/2/16/170207...robert-mueller
    social conservatism: the mortal fear that someone, somewhere, might be having fun.

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