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Thread: OT: Politics

  1. #601
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    I'm not against the existence of such a database. I'm more concerned with ensuring that it is safeguarded for appropriate uses that wouldn't violate anyone's rights. For example, some time ago, a couple counties in New York published their database on concealed carry permit holders, to include names and addresses, in response to a FOIA request. That kind of thing (and worse) simply cannot be allowed to happen.

  2. #602
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    Quote Originally Posted by cockerpunk View Post
    who said that?
    UV Halo said something that could be interpreted so in the paragraph you quoted just above this question.

  3. #603
    Quote Originally Posted by UV Halo View Post
    I'm not against the existence of such a database. I'm more concerned with ensuring that it is safeguarded for appropriate uses that wouldn't violate anyone's rights. For example, some time ago, a couple counties in New York published their database on concealed carry permit holders, to include names and addresses, in response to a FOIA request. That kind of thing (and worse) simply cannot be allowed to happen.
    again, like such databases for other issues, there is no need to attached names/information of that sort.
    social conservatism: the mortal fear that someone, somewhere, might be having fun.

  4. #604
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    Quote Originally Posted by cockerpunk View Post
    that is who collects the data for car accidents, law enforcement.

    the CDC has been trying to study gun violence since the late 1980s, the NRA backed and got passed a law that forbids them from doing so in 1996.



    who said that?

    - - - Updated - - -



    they are published:

    https://www.vox.com/2018/2/16/170207...robert-mueller
    I understand the past, I want to know what should be done in the future. I understand that Law enforcement provides information to the NHTSA for the establishiment (or revision) of regulations and policy- it makes sense as they (law enforcement) have a role in traffic law enforcement.
    I also would expect that law enforcement provides violent crime data. So, who should be researching or analyzing the data? Is there any reason why it should be the CDC and not the BATF?

  5. #605
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    Before you bash the GOP for doing nothing, remember that they proposed this and the democratic party filibustered it:

    https://www.grassley.senate.gov/site...Substitute.pdf

     Increases resources and tools for prosecuting criminals (Gun prosecutions have
    declined under President Obama and current proposed legislation does not address this
    issue)
    o Resources:
     National Project Exile Expansion. Provides $15 million per year for 3
    years for more Assistant U.S. Attorneys and Alcohol Tobacco and
    Firearms agents. Applies to fifteen jurisdictions with highest violent crime
    rates and three tribal jurisdictions with highest rates.
     Cruz Task Force. Task Force and $10 million per year for 5 years to
    prosecute felons and fugitives who try to get guns. Created task force and
    proposes funding of $10 million per year for five years to prosecute felons
    and fugitives who fail National Instant Criminal Background Check
    System (NICS) ? funded through the Asset Forfeiture Fund.
    o Tools:
     Criminalizes straw purchasing. In targeted, responsible way that doesn?t
    sweep in innocent conduct.
     Criminalizes trafficking. In a responsible way that doesn?t turn minor
    gun offenses into arms trafficking offenses.
     Increases resources for school safety (President Obama?s budget cut school safety
    funding)
    o Secure Our Schools grants. Provides $30 million per year for 10 years under
    Title III funds.
     Addresses mental health.
    o Increases resources for mental health.
     Reauthorizes Mentally Ill Offender Treatment and Crime Reduction Act.
    This provides $40 million per year for five years for mental health courts,
    crisis intervention teams, veteran treatment courts, police academy
    curricula, and transitional services in prison.
     Allows Byrne and COPS grants to be used for mental health purposes.
    o Gives states incentives to provide mental health records to NICS federal
    database.
     Reauthorizes NICS Improvement Amendments Act grants at $20 million
    per year for 5 years, so states can implement systems to report these
    records.
     Increases Byrne grant penalties for states? failure to provide mental health
    records.
    o Clarifies which records must be submitted NICS.
     Codifies Obama executive order requiring the Attorney General to issue
    guidance to federal agencies.
     Requires federal court information to be made available to NICS.
    o Fixes the definition of adjudicated mentally incompetent so single doctors
    can?t infringe on 2nd Amendment rights.

     Includes pro-gun provisions.
    o Allows interstate firearm sales.
    o Allows military members to buy guns in state of residence or where stationed.
    o Allows firearms dealers to access NICS to do background checks on employees
    (with notice and their consent).
    o Allows interstate transportation of firearms if certain conditions are met (e.g., in
    vehicle, unloaded, locked or in trunk), and preempts state law to the contrary.
     Increases executive branch accountability.
    o Federal agencies must submit a report to Congress on how many records they
    submit to NICS.
    o Attorney General must report to Congress on gun prosecutions.
    o Top official at DOJ must personally approve any Fast and Furious programs
    (selling guns to criminals).

    o Clarifies that ATF can?t collect information on purchases of certain rifles in
    southwest border states.
    o Requires report to Congress regarding ammunition purchases by federal
    agencies.
     Initiates a study by National Institute of Justice and National Academy of Sciences
    to solve mass shootings.
    Please don't say the GOP or NRA is unaware of the problem, nor contributing to it, that is incorrect. If the Democrats want to really do something, we may not have had this shooting, and we might have been able to stop other shootings in the past, like the TX Church shooting which would have been directly stopped with this bill.

    And if it really was that easy, when Obama was in office, and when the DNC held both the house and senate, why did they do nothing? This is kind of like the GOP when it comes to reduced spending. They both spew it out when they are out of power, but when they have gotten those votes and seated in power, they seem to be deaf to their own party.
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  6. #606
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    Quote Originally Posted by cockerpunk View Post
    again, like such databases for other issues, there is no need to attached names/information of that sort.
    A lot of folks believe in the free ability to transfer firearms outside the purview of the BATF and the background check system (i.e. transfering a firearm to a relative who is able to receive a firearm). I'm not sold on that idea. Presently, as best as I understand it, there is no effective database of those who go through the process (all of the forms are kept and transfered to wherehouses where it can be searched). If that is true, and it remains to be true then I personally would have no problem with every transfer being facilitated by a FFL.

  7. #607
    Quote Originally Posted by cockerpunk View Post
    also, dear chirst, mueller's indictment is fucking insane. it literally calls out known and and unknown american citizens as colluding with russians to get trump elected. wonder who those might be?

    collusion is treason.
    Keyword is "unwitting" in the indictment. Though Rosenstein made very clear that that term was limited to this particular indictment, which suggests there is much more to come

  8. #608
    Quote Originally Posted by pbjosh View Post
    Before you bash the GOP for doing nothing, remember that they proposed this and the democratic party filibustered it:

    https://www.grassley.senate.gov/site...Substitute.pdf



    Please don't say the GOP or NRA is unaware of the problem, nor contributing to it, that is incorrect. If the Democrats want to really do something, we may not have had this shooting, and we might have been able to stop other shootings in the past, like the TX Church shooting which would have been directly stopped with this bill.

    And if it really was that easy, when Obama was in office, and when the DNC held both the house and senate, why did they do nothing? This is kind of like the GOP when it comes to reduced spending. They both spew it out when they are out of power, but when they have gotten those votes and seated in power, they seem to be deaf to their own party.
    They probably didn't vote for it because it allowed the interstate sale of firearms, which effectively eliminates all state regulations on the sale of firearms. It was a poison pill masquerading as a solution.
    Last edited by d0cwho; 02-16-2018 at 04:51 PM.

  9. #609
    Quote Originally Posted by pbjosh View Post
    Before you bash the GOP for doing nothing, remember that they proposed this and the democratic party filibustered it:

    https://www.grassley.senate.gov/site...Substitute.pdf



    Please don't say the GOP or NRA is unaware of the problem, nor contributing to it, that is incorrect. If the Democrats want to really do something, we may not have had this shooting, and we might have been able to stop other shootings in the past, like the TX Church shooting which would have been directly stopped with this bill.

    And if it really was that easy, when Obama was in office, and when the DNC held both the house and senate, why did they do nothing? This is kind of like the GOP when it comes to reduced spending. They both spew it out when they are out of power, but when they have gotten those votes and seated in power, they seem to be deaf to their own party.
    the NRA and GOP are both 100% contributing to the problem.

    abso-fucking-lutly.
    social conservatism: the mortal fear that someone, somewhere, might be having fun.

  10. #610
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    Quote Originally Posted by d0cwho View Post
    Keyword is "unwitting" in the indictment. Though Rosenstein made very clear that that term was limited to this particular indictment, which suggests there is much more to come
    That would suggest someone up the chain was knowingly acting. Wonder who they'll try to throw under the bus as the "Mastermind".

    Also, inb4 "nothingburger"
    Ever so many citizens of this republic think they ought to believe that the Universe is a monarchy, and therefore they are always at odds with the republic. -Alan Watts

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