I was woundering...

[Grimm]

Ok, I've been wondering. I have noticed that a lot of the gun manufacturers seem to be going the route of the Gas-thru-the-grip frame. But why is that? Is it a new industry standard? For me it's kind of a buzz kill. I keep my set-ups nice & tight. With this going on, I can't set my guns/markers up the same if I get one of those. I still love running with a drop-forward & small tank. My set-up used to be so tight, that I had to change out my mask lens every 1 to 2 months from my cocking rod rubbing/hitting my mask. (got to love the old cockers ) I don't know, I guess I'm just stuck in the past- a reg, some fittings, a few feet of spare macro line & a drop. This has been a real bummer for me, because I really like some of the new designs that are coming out. So far what I have seen that will be hitting this year that some-what fit my needs in the JT Impulse & the Empire Res. Cocker.(but my wife will kill me if a get another gun so I guess I'm just venting a little) I do hope that the T-slot becomes the new standard for ASA mounting. I think its great! Just need some drop-forwards that have it. lol

[Simon]

It's not a standard, more a design trend.

I agree that the T-Slot system needs to become the standard for ASA mounts. It was as far as I was concerned at KEE and thanks to Jack Wood for providing the files so we could make them compatible where possible.

I remember someone made a T slot adapter to rail, maybe CP?, that might allow you to swap parts around to fit your needs.

There have also been options for the Mini/Axe that allowed a drop forward to be used, but I don't think they were very successful and fell to the side.

[pbjosh]

In our case, routing the air through the back of the grip as a gas through makes sense. The air doesn't go through the front of the gun, it is just a dump chamber. If it did we would have to have the spagetti routing seen in some guns to hit the compents. Because of that the bottom ASA/Reg setup and gas through grip makes more sense.

If done right it makes for fewer points of failure, parts to carry (no big fittings) and in some cases a simpler to maintain marker. Not all, as has been seen, but in some.

[PBSteve]

If done right it makes for fewer points of failure, parts to carry (no big fittings) and in some cases a simpler to maintain marker. Not all, as has been seen, but in some.

Pretty much this.

Macroline tubing itself is rarely rated to 900 psi, so there's a failure point. The tubing actually bursts on people. Add to that each macro fitting, which has a thread that needs to be sealed and an o-ring that seals against plastic tubing, one side of which is pretty exposed to the elements - probably the worst way to do it. And for anything that's inline, the air is being routed to the back of the marker anyway so if you use the foregrip for the regulator you're going from the back of the gun to the front of the gun then need to route LP air back to the rear of the gun. Since it's LP that means you need a big passage running through the gun to avoid shootdown.

To put it simply, running macro to the front of the gun via two fittings and an external tube that often isn't rated for it just so you can run it back to the rear of the gun never made a whole lot of sense. A "hard" passage through the frame with two o-rings has fewer failure points and for most guns isn't a serious drawback in terms of teching.

Then there's the Luxe, but that gun was designed from the ground up to please the status quo, not to be a sensibly designed marker. As a result you have what Josh described as "spaghetti" internal passages that are a pain in the ass to tech.

[Lumberjack]

Unless it is a Bob gun. His oring seals can't take as much pressure as macro.

[pbjosh]

I was kinda hoping the JT would take a split LPR setup with some DNA from the 2009 impulse.

Have the macroline and replaceable HPR, but have the ASA go to an internal LPR in the bottom of the grip, then run a hose to the solenoidvalve. Then you could balance the valve (or something) and you wouldn't have the in-body airpassage for the LPR to solenoidvalve like most have to have. Less internal passages and a simple LPR system like they had done in the past would also increase valve chamber volume. Lots of things they could have done, oh well...

[Grimm]

Hey, thank you all for the info! I can understand the why now! lol I just want to make clear I wasn't knockin the designs of these markers.
I did want to share with you all how I like my gun set ups.

Now just imagine that with a 45/4500 or 50/4500 tank on her and a Z2 hopper!(for the lower profile) I have 2 tips for the barrel kit. this one I cut down to give a 10" length. This is how I have pretty much have ran my set-up since 2001. Tho, I have usually ran a little larger drop(old psycobalistic drops)& an old warp feed system. Just I found I have no more layin around when I set this one up. The 07 ego I have is pretty much exactly the same but all blacked out. I will try to get a pic of her up here tomorrow. I know, I'm a weird one! lol

[pbjosh]

I still like a drop forward, just a bit, on smaller guns. I ran a vertical CO2 tank on quite a few guns and loved it. The mag with the vertical 12oz tank, 3ft of SS hose and a 14" barrel was my setup for years. With the new small 13ci HPA tanks I would run a vertical gun again.

Hmm...

[Grimm]

Here's the 07 Ego!

When I got her, she had no reg, no asa, no barrel & had a blue ccu kit/parts on her. The board read 10955 shots on the counter & only one light scuff on the body by the barrel. When I got her, I could have swarn it was a brand new marker! The guy I got her from said she started losing velocity then stopped shooting. After thinking about it for 2 sec, all I could think of was the reg went bad. He said he wanted to keep the reg before I could tell him that's what might be bad. I had a new Evil reg, some ninja black macro line fittings, & the drop off a Tippmann 98 custom pro sittin in my tool box & a 12" J&J ceramic sitting in my gear bag. All I had to buy was the oops asa. After I put her back together, she shot like a dream! I used her for a whole day of open play & not one hiccup. I got the rest of the black parts of ebay. The whole project(gun, asa, ccu kit) with shipping was $262! That was my deal of the month for Feb.

[Nobody]

hmmm, you still have the asa to the sniper?